Red Men’s Raided?!?
Legendary Dallas Game Doinked by 5-0

by , Sep 29, 2007 | 10:06 am

The most storied poker room in all of Dallas history got busted last night. Details are still scarce, but apparently one of the local players fingered as an undercover agent had been playing there recently on Friday nights … more info TK as we get it.

Even though Red Men’s (also known as Redmen’s, Red Man’s, and The Redman) had been around long before the poker boom and never sent out spam emails or set up a poker-based website to attract attention, it was a well-known venue that somehow always seemed to steer clear of legal troubles — police knew where they were, but no one ever answered the door when they came knocking. TJ Cloutier wrote about the place in his book, Doyle Brunson has talked warmly about his time at these tables, and here are some other references to it on the web:

Considering that most of the pending poker cases in Dallas county were swept out of court over the past few months, gotta wonder what the impetus for this jacking was … and if the 25/50 game was going, how much money was confiscated?

UPDATE: There’s gotta be more to this story.


23 Comments to “Red Men’s Raided?!?
Legendary Dallas Game Doinked by 5-0


  1. Bill Peater
    says:

    It’s about time!! We have laws for a reason…I hope they put all of them in jail for years!!!!


  2. John in North Dallas
    says:

    Here is the partial skinny,

    Police came into the Red Men last night. They did not bust down the door or come storming in. However, they let them know that if they did not open the door, that they would be comming in anyway. The two players that I have spoken with say that the police escorted them outside and let them go; no citations. I do not know if this was true for all of the players, but I do not know why they would discriminate. Reportedly one Asian Female, well known in Dallas poker circles, is the only person who went to jail.

    It has also been reported that this happened because a person who worked at the Red Men met a player named Bruce at Windstar. He is a large balding w/m in his thirties or early forties. This Red Men employee invited him to play at the Red Men. This is the same description that has previously circulated about an undercover Dallas officer working the underground circuit.

    Just because someone playes poker, does not mean that they are automatically “O.K.” (However it does make them better than the average individual.)

    That’s what I know. Good luck keeping the drawers off of you.


  3. DanM
    says:

    Wow, Bill, not what I expected for the first comment. But if you really want to see poker players put “in jail for years!!!!” … all I can say is that as with poker, hope is
    seldom a good strategy.

    Now would you like to get into some fiscal realities? Because if you truly would like to see every legally questionable poker player put in jail for any amount of time, you could expect your personal tax bill to increase by a few thousand bucks. Just sayin’ … you brought it up.


  4. DanM
    says:

    ***It has also been reported that this happened because a person who worked at the Red Men met a player named Bruce at Windstar. He is a large balding w/m in his thirties or early forties.***

    Out of curiosity, what game did these guys play in? 5/10?


  5. IBW
    says:

    Bruce [Name redacted], if memory serves.


  6. Karridy
    says:

    I’m sure Mr. Peater Eater is as close to Jesus as a human can be in order to make such a heavy-handed statement. And if so, I would ask why he is visiting this site? After all, is gambling itself a creation of the devil? And if you don’t agree with that statement, it would only support my assumption that you will agree that people possess the liberties to decide, much like you, what they do and don’t agree with.

    Your prior statement makes it very clear that you wish horrible things for the persons involved; that we know. Instead of spending the rest of this post judging you, as you have others, I’d rather give thanks that I don’t live a life retarded by prejudice and contempt for total strangers.

    Not to get too preachy, but I wonder how a person like you feels comfortable going anywhere near a church. If you somehow do, you are a complete hypocrite, assuming you are of any faith I am familiar with. If you don’t attend church, little options are available that result in anything other than you being less than perfect. I am admittedly less than perfect. But I’ll reserve my hopes for extreme punishment for the child molesters, rapists, murderers, and other violent criminals of the world. And I’ll save a few well wishes for the assholes like you.


  7. DanM
    says:

    Karridy, in dude’s defense, he doesn’t mention Jesus. regardless of who he worships or who’s genitals he chows, poker is not a matter of christian vs. agnostic … nor should it be. (save for maybe the final table of the WSOP main event.)


  8. donkey
    says:

    The night when Jackies, JBs, and Ace High got raided, it was known that Bruce was in all three rooms the night prior to the raids. He brought a friend whom he claims know nothing about NLHE. They would go to one room, stay for about an hour, then find a reason to skip out and go to the next room. I guess everyone except for Redmen knows who this guy is. I’m not going to say what his reported last name is, but it sounds like a familiar ketchup.


  9. IBW
    says:

    Or like hiney without the “Y”


  10. Karridy
    says:

    Dan,.. Any and every time I have made a comment that amounts to anything less than a circle jerk for the original poster, you feel the need to argue instead with me over semantics. Think not? Check the logs. I did mention faith, but you need to review the context and find the point I was truly making. I was worried that I should have explained it better, but not on your account.


  11. Woody
    says:

    “Reportedly one Asian Female, well known in Dallas poker circles, is the only person who went to jail.”

    Two-letter first name?


  12. DanM
    says:

    Karridy says:

    ***I’m sure Mr. Peater Eater is as close to Jesus as a human can be in order to make such a heavy-handed statement. ***

    If this is the FIRST thing you say and it’s easily dismissed because the original comment gives no such indication … it makes any brilliance that follows irrelevant, no? Based on his statement — “It’s about time!! We have laws for a reason…I hope they put all of them in jail for years!!!!” — I’d say that there is only about a 63 percent chance that he is kinda-close to Jesus.

    Sorry for throwing you under the hyperbolic bus, K-man. But I appreciate all you do to make me look smart cautious with the facts and fair-minded with accusations.


  13. donkey
    says:

    Also, watch out for an african american shaved headed dude who goes by TJ. He’s in the same circle with Bruce and my source swears that he’s vice as well.


  14. DanM
    says:

    Speaking of accusations, man, this Bruce guy has got to find it hard to find a seat around town, no? You all really seem to want to out him. Sorry for the deletion of the last name … part of me would be happy to post a picture to warn any theoretically remaining poker rooms, but for now, since I don’t know who this real person is I’m not ready to Google-y attach him to this post … you know, a little innocent until proven guilty … let alone become Bob Novak to his Valerie Plame.


  15. Scott Chaffin
    says:

    Karridy, it was a stupid comment based on a stupid assumption to which you willingly and immediately jumped. As a respected host, you should work out your personal issues with faith and organized religion in another forum (unless and until someone brings it here first.) It’s offensive and irritating to find it on a post about the bust of the famous Red Man’s.

    Now, the question that needs to be answered is this: why is the PD still busting poker rooms when the DA’s office quite clearly can’t or won’t prosecute the resulting cases? There are many possible reasons: publicity, lack of other things to do, overly zealous leadership on the vice team, and I’m sure more creative types will think of additional options. Me, I’m partial to the ‘follow the money’ truism — where’s all the cash money from the busts?


  16. donkey
    says:

    “Federal Indictments Imminent in City Hall Corruption Case, Says Channel 11” I sure hope that peckerhead Kunkle is on the list. It’s ironic that he and a bunch of corrupted idiots in city hall are busting poker players, when it’s not the poker players who will be doing time. I predict Bill Peater (stands for pecker eater) is on the list as well.


  17. DanM
    says:

    Very interesting. I gotta think Kunkle is safe. After all, Sarah Dodd did a lot of the original breaking of said city hall corruption story … and now she is married to the chief. Unless she’s going REALLY undercover …

    But I do think there is some inner turmoil in the DPD that a bunch of poker players have gotten caught up in in some capacity.

    Am I the only one that suspects there might be at least a few people in the Dallas Police Department who are NOT happy about the Red Man’s bust?


  18. Karridy
    says:

    Alright, Scotty… Let me run this back for you and anybody else who was misdirected by the shiny object.

    “Karridy, it was a stupid comment based on a stupid assumption to which you willingly and immediately jumped.”
    What assumptions are you possibly talking about? The only assumptions I made were 1) He likes to pass judgment. 2) He’s not perfect. 3) He’s probably an asshole.

    A show of hand please from anybody who can intelligently argue against these 3 charges. The only item that is possibly up for debate is #3. But I’m going to go out on a limb and say that if anybody who read the original post is having trouble with this one, they themselves might benefit from asking somebody they trust if *they*, too, might be an asshole. If the responses are hesitant or you simply don’t have anybody to ask… well…

    “As a respected host, you should work out your personal issues with faith and organized religion in another forum (unless and until someone brings it here first.)”
    OOohhhh… Shiney object. – Guys, come on, seriously. My point was that so many people in this world are a walking contradiction. Here is a guy wishing horrible things on people I’m sure he has never met. He’s logged onto Pokerati why? Because he likes poker? I doubt it. If he knew two shits about the game, he’d know what kind of great people can be met and friends made around a poker table. It’s the social aspects that make the game great. It’s the social aspects that keep people reading this site and listening to BeyondTheTable. But it doesn’t even matter if you agree with that….My point: He’s not perfect. I used church only as what I thought would be a clear supporting argument, saying, He can’t choose to be so hateful and prejudice on Friday and attend church on Sunday. And if he doesn’t attend at all, few options are available to him to otherwise reach the level of perfection that would give one the right to pass that sort of blind, strong-handed judgment. Basically,… Who the hell does he think he is!? – But with all the defense he’s getting from people who claim to love the game, I would understand if he had a skewed sense of self.

    Faith was used for illustration only. Again, I thought this would be very clear. My bad. Though I can’t honestly say that I would have ever guessed that mixing a mention of church and Redman’s in the same post would “offend” you, nor do I believe that I would have changed a single word if I had. It’s actually kinda irritating to me that you think I should feel obligated to tip-toe around easily offended readers who can’t handle a reference to faith and poker in the same post. I mean, really, didn’t Dan’s one-million’th homosexual joke get rid of all the super-softies years ago? Not to lump you in with Mr. Peater, but I’m sure internet porn has never tarnished your computer screen either? When did everybody become so fucking high and mighty? Yes, I just said “fuck” in the same post as “church”.

    THIS IS A POKER BLOG. AND BECA– USE SIMPLY READING THIS TELLS ME THAT YOU KNOW HOW TO — USE THE INTERWEBS, I WILL TEND TO TREAT YOU ALL LIKE BIG BOYS AND GIRLS.

    It’s offensive and irritating to find it on a post about the bust of the famous Red Man’s.”
    This is my favorite. At risk of accidentally implying that this statement is any more intelligent than it reads, I have to say that when I first read it, I actually imagined it being typed by this guy. Seriously. No joke…. at all.

    Pokeratizens,.. Was I a little tacky just then? Sure. Should I have handled that differently? Probably, and I’m sure Dan will agree. Should I apologize to Scott or feel in some way obligated to be censored in the analogies I choose when I argue my opinions, simply because I blog here? Quite the contrary. The comments we get are, in my opinion, often so much more valuable than the posts they reference. You guys are far more valuable then I every could be, and I can’t imagine expecting you to censor or muffle your opinions. That doesn’t mean I won’t get pissy and argue with you occasionally. That’s what’s so cool. Seriously. Anything else would just be… well… CardPlayer. (Oops!™ – I did it again:)


  19. DanM
    says:

    My only point was don’t discredit your own words by saying you are SURE of something you can’t be sure of. (It’s not CardPlayer to do so, but it is a little 2+2.) “Almost certain” or “pretty sure” woulda made this more a discussion of judgmental types (who jump to conclusions that all people who knowingly break a law are bad) than one about adjectives and typography.

    By the way, that’s a lot of bold-face.


  20. Karridy
    says:

    “I’m sure Mr. Peater Eater is as close to Jesus as a human can be in order to make such a heavy-handed statement.” – This is the only “sure” I use, and it’s totally sarcastic. Is this what you mean? Can’t be. I’m lost.

    Either I make my reply text bold, to differentiate from Scott’s, or hot pink. But I was afraid that using pink text in my post might only add to the misinterpretations.


  21. Ed
    says:

    All I can say is…Karridy’s response was a lot more PC than mine would have been. 🙂


  22. Willie
    says:

    Trolling on the Pokerati message boards?
    That’s a first.


  23. Ty
    says:

    Most of these busts have a definite similarity; they happen on the day of a big tournament. Irwin from the Redman had called me to come play in a $550 buyin tourney last week. I am assuming the bust was centered around this. From the cops perspective, these busts are probably an easy way to fund their other undercover activities. It only takes a couple of hours, it’s relatively safe (free from gunfire, etc), and they normally pick up over $10K.

    I never thought I would say this, but underground poker in Dallas is dead.