Illinois Shuts Down Free Poker
by Dan Michalski, Oct 10, 2007 | 6:15 am
In a sign of how hard it is to convince non-poker people how different types of poker work … the Illinois liquor police are shutting down the amateur bar tournaments that so many of us (nationwide) know and love:
Rather than trying to sort out those playing poker for fun from those playing poker for money, they say it makes more sense to simply prohibit poker tournaments in liquor establishments.
“Usually when you’re playing poker, you’re gambling,” says Ted Penesis, a spokesman for the liquor commission.
Yeow, nice enforcement standards. Apparently there’s no need to send in an undercover agent when you’re not gonna find what you’re looking for.
Uncle Ray says:
October 10th, 2007 at 7:56am
I was going to comment on the sorry state of affairs in Illinois, but it would be a long (read ultimately boring) treatise about the Gaming Board, the Racing Board, the Liquor Commission, the Legislature, the Governor, and the people who want to blame the organizers of the Marathon Sunday for not cancelling the race. (it was too hot…in Chicago…in October. I guess no marathon was ever run in over 85 degree temps)
In fact, just making a list of the people in my state that can’t get ANYTHING done was long and boring.
Garry says:
October 10th, 2007 at 12:21pm
Seems the TABC office in Waco thinks the same as the Illinois liquor commission.
DanM says:
October 10th, 2007 at 3:30pm
Garry, not sure what you are referring to. But you do know that the Attorney General has issued a non-binding opinion in Texas asserting that free poker CAN’T be illegal — because it’s not gambling when you risk no money.
This document has been the basis for many an amateur poker league for the past couple years.
CardChucker says:
October 10th, 2007 at 4:10pm
Well, I’m going to Chicago this weekend and I suppose it’s not a good time to find a game to occupy my time while the lady is out bad-beating my pocket book. I guess I’ll have to deal with the Sears tower and the Magnificent Mile.
Haley says:
October 10th, 2007 at 9:16pm
I was in contact with this Ted Penesis today on my personal dime about this, since I currently live in this wretched state. His response in part:
‘That’s me, and my birthday has been truly special today! People file lots of complaints about the activity in question, specifically stating that gambling occurs at these events. As the regulating agency for liquor establishments, we have a duty to investigate these cases and enforce the law; to do otherwise, would be “bad government.”‘
My response was to the effect that truly bad government was that which creates and enforces imaginary laws to satisfy people who don’t know what the laws really are. More to follow.
Oh, I wished him a happy birthday, too.
DanM says:
October 11th, 2007 at 4:16am
Haley, that’s well said. And a fine answer by the liquor guy … if they truly want to investigate. I don’t know firsthand how these amateur tourneys run in my birth/collegiate/family stomping grounds … but I’d be willing to wager that a supermajority aren’t just fronts for money games.
I was surprised, too, to see how popular free tourneys could be. But then again, considering that tens of thousands are playing free online at any given second, there’s plenty of proof that the game can be enjoyed without money at stake.
Here’s how you know the liquor police are on a (politically motivated?) bluff, or at least making a move with a hand that won’t hold up:
If these are illegal card games, then so is McDonald’s Monopoly, where you can win a million dollars, no purchase necessary.
Uncle Ray says:
October 11th, 2007 at 8:36am
What do you mean by “Haley, that’s well said”? Haley called my state “wretched”! Never mind. Well said, Haley!
And Dan, the only problem with the McD analogy is that the only power the Liquor Commission has is to take away your liquor license. And I haven’t been able to get a Mctini (with an olive, easy on the vermouth) in ages. (At least in Illinois. If you know of a Macs that serves, I think a beer would sure wash down a QP cheese better than a Coke.)
DanM says:
October 11th, 2007 at 11:55am
i meant well-said except the wretched part. clearly there are worse states, like wisconsin.
but that’s part of my point with the mcdonald’s reference, uncle ray … that this very likely has to do with something internal with the liquor police.
problem is that no bar wants to RISK their whole business (essentially) to challenge the liquor police on their b.s.
[DanM via mobile.]
Haley says:
October 11th, 2007 at 3:04pm
Lol, you guys.
Yeah, I’m from Wisconsin, currently live in Illinois, and am considering becoming a hermit and moving to the Montana mountains… but within running range of the Canadian border. Or maybe Burkina Faso or whatever the hell it says on that one blog of mine.
This Penesis guy is a cracker; I’ve definitely gotten under his skin, since I’ve received two e-mail replies from him already and am expecting a third, because I’ll keep baiting him. His agency really dislikes being reminded of its policy-by-intimidation routine; now he’s going on about the “law,” to which I’ve said, “Please show me the law that says playing cards for fun constitutes gambling; I’d love to see it.” I’m hoping for ALL CAPS next letter. 🙂
The problem, Dan, is that they -don’t- want to investigate. They want to do the social tradeoff with as little real work as possible while justifying their license fees and agency budget.
Now if I could convince you how truly beautiful the northern part of Wisconsin is… 20,000 lakes up there. Door County and the Apostle Islands aren’t too shabby, either.
Free Poker » Illinois Shuts Down Free Poker says:
October 17th, 2007 at 8:54am
[…] DanM wrote an interesting post today on Illinois Shuts Down Free PokerHere’s a quick excerptIn a sign of how hard it is to convince non-poker people how different types of poker work … the Illinois liquor police are shutting down the amateur bar tournaments that so many of us (nationwide) know and love: Rather than trying to … […]
Free Poker » Comment on Illinois Shuts Down Free Poker by DanM says:
October 17th, 2007 at 8:54am
[…] DanM wrote an interesting post today on Comment on Illinois Shuts Down Free Poker by DanMHere’s a quick excerptBut you do know that the Attorney General has issued a non-binding opinion in Texas asserting that free poker CAN’T be illegal  because it’s not gambling when you risk no money. This document has been the basis for many an amateur … […]
Free Poker » Comment on Illinois Shuts Down Free Poker by Haley says:
October 17th, 2007 at 8:54am
[…] Haley wrote an interesting post today on Comment on Illinois Shuts Down Free Poker by HaleyHere’s a quick excerptI was in contact with this Ted Penesis today on my personal dime about this, since I currently live in this wretched state. His response in part:. ‘That’s me, and my birthday has been truly special today! People file lots of complaints … […]